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[Music]

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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Music]

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the skeptics zone coming to you from

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Sydney Australia hello this is

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Richardson is with you once again coming

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up on this week's show dr. Alice health

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all the way from Liverpool will chat to

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us now she is one of the co-hosts of

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skeptics with a cave a fabulous podcast

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I've been listening to for years

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skeptics with a ke Alice dr. alice is

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coming to Australia to take part in

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skeptic on she's going to tell us all

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about that and some of her research into

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cancer specifically cancer in biology a

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fascinating woman indeed coming up at

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the top of the show following that detox

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my fort now a foot detox this has been

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prompted by a poster I saw in a in a

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window of a massage parlor and you've

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probably seen these devices yourself at

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least advertising this is where you put

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your foot into a foot bath so to speak

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and it's supposedly detox is your body

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does it my foot after that Maynard

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spooky action may nod heads once again

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to Sydney skeptics in the pub and asks

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pub goers what they think about

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so-called psychics and clairvoyance

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doing shows at RSL clubs or clubs here

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in Australia dedicated to returned

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service men and women veterans of

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conflicts and these clubs are really set

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up to honor the dead and yet they have

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shows with these so-called psychics and

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paranormal people pretending or thinking

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they can to contact the dead what the

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pub goers think about that and also may

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not chat to a couple of new listeners

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after then we catch up with Claire

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Klingenberg from the Czech Republic who

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was recently in Scotland and Germany and

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when she was in Germany she helped to

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test some paranormal claims

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wow that is so interesting now in this

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interview you'll hear me say that there

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is a video of the tests in German which

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there is of course and link in the show

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notes but I've just discovered just

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before putting this show out that the

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Deutsche Welle have translated the clip

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into English both links will be on this

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week's show notes so if you want to

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watch that in German you understand

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German go for it or English then to

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round off the show maenad my report on

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the recent Australian skeptics blood

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drive here in Sydney and I'm happy to

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report about a week or so after I

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donated some blood I got a message from

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the Blood Service telling me that my

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blood had been used to save lives

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already and this gives one a very nice

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feeling more messages and updates from

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me at the end of the show but now it's

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time for me to run downstairs being

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careful not to trip over those cats and

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maybe make myself up a serving of fish

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and chips and through the magic of

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editing come back and bring you the rest

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of the skipping zone

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[Music]

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and joining me now all the way from

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Liverpool its dr. Alice how with hello

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hi hi Richards I were wonderful to chat

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to a fellow podcaster all the way on the

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other side of the world and before we

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get stuck into all the other details

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before we get started on all the other

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information what's it what's it like for

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you now you've been with skeptics with a

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Kay for quite a while I think it has

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been it's been a good few years now I

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think just over three years now the

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halfway point we're now more episodes

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with me than with the original host

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starting host Colleen so well why that's

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fantastic and I I imagine like the rest

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of us doing podcasts you find it mostly

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fun

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don't have to do very much of the

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editing so it's great fun for me I just

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have to write a story and record one

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every every couple of weeks though it's

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very lucky not to have to deal with

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editing issues right right oh well there

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you go

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that makes a lot more fun I think for

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you I will say part of the the pleasure

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of doing it from my point of view being

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producer is you know mixing all the

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sound and putting people's voices on

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different tracks although it can take a

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lot of time but too worried about

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hearing about that look congratulations

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on your good work with skeptics with the

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Kate certainly one of the premier

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skeptical podcasts around the world and

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I'm so pleased when shows like skeptics

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with the Kay have longevity ya know it's

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been it's been going a good well and

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that's that's a real testament to to

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make and wash my co-hosts they they

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really do put so much work into it that

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I'm very lucky to be to be part of it

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absolutely yeah yeah the great fellows I

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know them both

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very well I can't remember off the top

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of my head we made it QED I think we

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might have done yeah I think

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everything-everything was incredibly

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busy and convention so I think it was a

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brief hello rather than anything more

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than that you're probably right but

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anyway we shall certainly make up for

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any lack of social niceties soon coming

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up you'll be flying to Australia to take

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part in skeptic on now you're in very

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soon yeah your background is in biology

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isn't it

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yes yes so I finished a PhD in cancer

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research just over a year ago a little

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over a year ago so I've been doing kind

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of hardcore bench science for actually

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close to six years now and throughout

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the duration of my PhD and then and then

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in my subsequent work post ducking so

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very science heavy yeah really and then

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this I mean this would give you an

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interesting insight especially from a

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sceptical angle you must have come

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across in your travels very disturbing

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examples of cancer quackery absolutely

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yeah yeah and and much more through

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through my work with the medicine

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skeptic Society that kind of finding

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pseudoscience

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are pitching cancer treatments to

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general members of the population I

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fairly recently attended a talk which I

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will talk about skeptic on a proponent

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of Gerson Therapy and and the

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recommendations that this guy who runs a

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clinic over in Mexico would make two

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patients many patients in his audience

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who you know a suffering from you know

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battling with cancer and not getting the

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advice they need some doctors because

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often being pushed in into the kind of

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alternative medicine routine yeah it's

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very very distressing to to hear that

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such that strong advocacy of things that

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have no evidence behind

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especially when on a science level I see

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how complicated cancer is but how

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understanding that complexity is the

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important part of understanding how we

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can treat it rather than telling

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patients that you can cure it all with

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diet well exactly and I think it's it's

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interesting that a lot of the people and

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and I've never been able to really put

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my finger on the number here but a lot

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of people involved in in the natural

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world the natural alternative medicine a

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true true believers but and you get

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residual who are the the scammy con men

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and con women out there and the true

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believers could be so sincere because

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they are sincere yes they genuinely

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genuinely believe that they're helping

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people and that they that they have the

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answer and unfortunately the science

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doesn't back that up and and it is a

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dangerous game to be as you say that but

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sincerity really sells it to people and

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that can be very very dangerous

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yeah and coupled with that is the belief

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amongst certain a certain percentage of

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the population that medical science

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knows the cure for cancer but they just

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simply withhold it to keep people sick

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to keep selling yes to make money one of

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the more frustrating things they

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encounter being involved in skepticism

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and being very interested in cancer

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research because you know I I have

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worked with a lot of different people

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people who are Research Associates at

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universities associated with academia

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with professors who are running labs

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within academia and I've also worked

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with some smaller pharmaceutical

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companies and I can tell I can tell you

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know you don't do this but for the money

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it is right research is very much you're

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doing it because you want to progress

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progress things in research if you're

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researching in academia and basic

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research and for many pharmaceutical

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many of the researchers working in

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pharmaceutical companies it's all about

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you know finding answers and making a

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difference to to our understanding of

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cancer

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yeah and it's a slow

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process and absolutely again a lot of

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the people who need answers it's very

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hard for them to accept that I mean

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we've only progressed so far which i

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think though when you when you look at

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it we've progressed a long way yeah we

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can't cure these things overnight just

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yet

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exactly and that's that's kind of

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exactly what I will talk about it

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skeptic on is that this disease is not

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one disease it's actually an incredibly

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complicated set of hundreds of diseases

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and it's understanding the biology of

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how cancer works is fundamental to

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understanding why we don't have a magic

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bullet cure yet why we have to work

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towards better treatments increasing

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lifespan for patients and just improving

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the number of years that patients go

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into remission because it's not

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something that happens over overnight

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but we have made this incredible

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progress we've doubled life expectancy

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in the last 40 years because of all the

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research that we're doing that's a good

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figure to keep in mind actually because

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you know in my lifespan which is nearly

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53 years now when our remember you know

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my first recollections of this hearing

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about cancers and stuff like that the

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prognosis wasn't so good but now it's

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it's dramatically different yes yeah we

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really have made such huge progress in

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prolonging life for patients and

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improving quality of life because I

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think a lot of people forget that and

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and certainly it helps support

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proponents of alternative therapies

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obviously treating cancer gives nasty

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side effects but there are an awful lot

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of researchers who are trying to find

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ways to improve quality of life for

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patients who are on chemotherapy or

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different types of treatment to not just

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prolong life but also make that life

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more comfortable yeah yeah absolutely

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right so I mean the message I suppose

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you'll be giving in the general message

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is that things are getting better

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we can't make them better quick enough

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for some people of obviously which is

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just the way things are but medical

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science is progressing as best it can

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absolutely yeah we're making huge

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strides and working incredibly hard to

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do it you know certainly the academic

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researchers and the industry researchers

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00:12:59,730 --> 00:12:57,400
that I've worked are working many many

278
00:13:01,830 --> 00:12:59,740
many more hours than most people would

279
00:13:04,290 --> 00:13:01,840
imagine you know it's not it's it's not

280
00:13:06,900 --> 00:13:04,300
a job that lends itself to a lot of free

281
00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:06,910
time but people do it for the love of

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00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:08,650
the science and they really push and

283
00:13:13,550 --> 00:13:11,290
work as hard as they can yeah yeah

284
00:13:16,260 --> 00:13:13,560
you're absolutely right and it also

285
00:13:18,300 --> 00:13:16,270
again and irks us when there's this

286
00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:18,310
belief out there that people like you

287
00:13:22,290 --> 00:13:20,170
you know hard-working people really

288
00:13:25,380 --> 00:13:22,300
interested in getting to the answers are

289
00:13:27,180 --> 00:13:25,390
somehow part of them the the evil well

290
00:13:28,950 --> 00:13:27,190
conspiracy and you're just keeping the

291
00:13:31,610 --> 00:13:28,960
answers from everybody it's it's quite

292
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:31,620
sad really yeah yeah absolutely

293
00:13:35,430 --> 00:13:33,970
well look we're looking forward to

294
00:13:38,340 --> 00:13:35,440
hearing all about that and much more

295
00:13:41,190 --> 00:13:38,350
when you come to too skeptic on and not

296
00:13:43,380 --> 00:13:41,200
far away now folks and we'll also um I'm

297
00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:43,390
sure you'll also be regaling us of your

298
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:45,250
stories of your adventures with the

299
00:13:48,870 --> 00:13:48,010
Merseyside skeptic society - yes

300
00:13:53,910 --> 00:13:48,880
absolutely

301
00:13:55,170 --> 00:13:53,920
can't wait to meet you again I can't

302
00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:55,180
wait to meet you again I'm sure we'll

303
00:13:58,530 --> 00:13:56,650
have a lot of fun here and Sydney yes

304
00:14:01,590 --> 00:13:58,540
and of course I can't wait to see your

305
00:14:03,660 --> 00:14:01,600
talk when you give it frot live from the

306
00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:03,670
stage folks there's yet another clue for

307
00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:06,850
you another hint - erm - quickly run to

308
00:14:10,950 --> 00:14:08,770
the website and it links in this week's

309
00:14:13,410 --> 00:14:10,960
show notes and get your tickets to see

310
00:14:15,420 --> 00:14:13,420
dr. Alice hours in person well Alice

311
00:14:17,940 --> 00:14:15,430
thank you once again and we'll see you

312
00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:17,950
very soon in Sydney thank you very much

313
00:14:26,430 --> 00:14:20,770
I'll see you soon bye bye

314
00:14:31,030 --> 00:14:29,380
hey max fun listeners have you been

315
00:14:32,710 --> 00:14:31,040
listening to max fun for a while and

316
00:14:34,870 --> 00:14:32,720
you've just been wondering where's the

317
00:14:36,670 --> 00:14:34,880
new Flat Earth podcast to keep hearing

318
00:14:39,850 --> 00:14:36,680
about well here it is we give you all

319
00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:39,860
the facts on NASA's lies and how we know

320
00:14:47,350 --> 00:14:44,450
that the earth is actually flat this is

321
00:14:49,270 --> 00:14:47,360
oh no Ross and Carrie and we joined

322
00:14:51,370 --> 00:14:49,280
fringe religious groups we undergo

323
00:14:53,050 --> 00:14:51,380
alternative medical treatments and we

324
00:14:55,090 --> 00:14:53,060
hang out with people like 9/11 truthers

325
00:14:57,430 --> 00:14:55,100
flat-earthers we find out why do people

326
00:14:59,110 --> 00:14:57,440
believe strange things we join them and

327
00:15:00,790 --> 00:14:59,120
we tell you all about it we have a lot

328
00:15:02,940 --> 00:15:00,800
of fun we'd make a lot of friends yeah

329
00:15:05,530 --> 00:15:02,950
we do we joined the Mormons we join the

330
00:15:07,780 --> 00:15:05,540
Scientologists we got acupuncture we got

331
00:15:09,340 --> 00:15:07,790
fire cups we got ear candled we've done

332
00:15:11,170 --> 00:15:09,350
it all and we're gonna keep doing it all

333
00:15:17,950 --> 00:15:11,180
why don't you check out oh no Ross and

334
00:15:31,119 --> 00:15:28,739
[Music]

335
00:15:32,829 --> 00:15:31,129
couple of weeks ago I was walking

336
00:15:35,049 --> 00:15:32,839
through Sydney looking for some

337
00:15:37,119 --> 00:15:35,059
microphone filters they call them

338
00:15:40,569 --> 00:15:37,129
popping filters or wind screens or

339
00:15:44,529 --> 00:15:40,579
windshields stops the pepper sound when

340
00:15:46,119 --> 00:15:44,539
your anyway let's fly by I was heading

341
00:15:48,279 --> 00:15:46,129
for a music shop that sells them and

342
00:15:51,999 --> 00:15:48,289
just before I got to the music shop I'm

343
00:15:53,649 --> 00:15:52,009
past eight massage parlor and massage

344
00:15:57,669 --> 00:15:53,659
parlors a common in Sydney they usually

345
00:16:00,129 --> 00:15:57,679
Thai massage parlors and yes this was

346
00:16:01,749 --> 00:16:00,139
quite nice relaxing from time to time in

347
00:16:05,229 --> 00:16:01,759
the window of this particular one

348
00:16:08,979 --> 00:16:05,239
however it was one of these detox foot

349
00:16:10,689 --> 00:16:08,989
baths or a page about it with a

350
00:16:13,499 --> 00:16:10,699
photograph of someone seeking their feet

351
00:16:16,659 --> 00:16:13,509
into a detox bath and then progressively

352
00:16:20,919 --> 00:16:16,669
photographs of the water turning dark

353
00:16:22,659 --> 00:16:20,929
and murky and on the page stuck to the

354
00:16:25,929 --> 00:16:22,669
window was a little chart that says

355
00:16:27,929 --> 00:16:25,939
color or particulate and color is spelt

356
00:16:31,149 --> 00:16:27,939
the American Way that's interesting and

357
00:16:35,019 --> 00:16:31,159
next to it material or area of the body

358
00:16:37,709 --> 00:16:35,029
being detoxified so recording this

359
00:16:42,039 --> 00:16:37,719
little chart if the water turns black

360
00:16:47,169 --> 00:16:42,049
its detoxifying from your liver black

361
00:16:51,039 --> 00:16:47,179
flecks heavy metals Brown detoxifying

362
00:16:55,349 --> 00:16:51,049
from the liver cellular debris tobacco

363
00:17:00,329 --> 00:16:55,359
dark green detoxifying from gall bladder

364
00:17:06,399 --> 00:17:00,339
orange detoxifying from joints red flex

365
00:17:08,559 --> 00:17:06,409
blood clot material yeah I'd be pretty

366
00:17:10,829 --> 00:17:08,569
worried if there was blood clot material

367
00:17:14,769 --> 00:17:10,839
coming out through the soles of my feet

368
00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:14,779
white cheese like particulates most

369
00:17:23,049 --> 00:17:19,129
likely yeast most likely yeast white

370
00:17:26,159 --> 00:17:23,059
foam sounds dire detoxifying from the

371
00:17:28,090 --> 00:17:26,169
lymphatic system yellow-green

372
00:17:30,980 --> 00:17:28,100
detoxifying from the kidneys bladder

373
00:17:35,090 --> 00:17:30,990
urinary tract female

374
00:17:38,090 --> 00:17:35,100
slash prostate area Wow you can't get

375
00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:38,100
much more scientific than this well of

376
00:17:42,950 --> 00:17:39,450
course there are many pages on the

377
00:17:46,910 --> 00:17:42,960
internet that explode or debunk this

378
00:17:50,870 --> 00:17:46,920
quack device and here's one ad device

379
00:17:54,380 --> 00:17:50,880
watch which is from the quack watch web

380
00:17:58,430 --> 00:17:54,390
site device watch your guide to

381
00:18:01,640 --> 00:17:58,440
questionable medical devices the awkward

382
00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:01,650
detox camp by Stephen Barrett MD and if

383
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:03,330
you'll remember we interviewed Stephen

384
00:18:08,419 --> 00:18:04,650
Barrett a couple of weeks ago on the

385
00:18:10,910 --> 00:18:08,429
sceptic zone and the page says one way

386
00:18:14,750 --> 00:18:10,920
to scam people is to diagnose and

387
00:18:18,020 --> 00:18:14,760
correct a non-existent problem awkward

388
00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:18,030
detox practitioners do this by claiming

389
00:18:25,430 --> 00:18:21,210
to remove toxins and balance cellular

390
00:18:28,370 --> 00:18:25,440
energy during treatment sessions the

391
00:18:31,490 --> 00:18:28,380
customers feet are bathed for 30 minutes

392
00:18:33,620 --> 00:18:31,500
in salt water that is subject to low

393
00:18:38,450 --> 00:18:33,630
voltage current transmitted through

394
00:18:40,790 --> 00:18:38,460
electrode assembly called an array the

395
00:18:43,430 --> 00:18:40,800
dark cylindrical object to which the

396
00:18:45,500 --> 00:18:43,440
wires attached awkward detox

397
00:18:48,860 --> 00:18:45,510
international claims that the apparatus

398
00:18:51,799 --> 00:18:48,870
quote produces a frequency of positive

399
00:18:54,710 --> 00:18:51,809
and negative ions which gently resonates

400
00:18:57,590 --> 00:18:54,720
through the body and stimulates all the

401
00:19:00,169 --> 00:18:57,600
cells within it rebalancing the cellular

402
00:19:03,770 --> 00:19:00,179
energy enabling the cells to perform

403
00:19:06,530 --> 00:19:03,780
efficiently and release any toxins that

404
00:19:08,540 --> 00:19:06,540
may have built up in quote during the

405
00:19:11,690 --> 00:19:08,550
process the water typically turns

406
00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:11,700
reddish-brown some marketers refer to

407
00:19:18,049 --> 00:19:14,610
the process as quote ionic cleansing in

408
00:19:21,860 --> 00:19:18,059
quote or and quote ionic foot bath man

409
00:19:24,740 --> 00:19:21,870
quote another marketer mobile beauty

410
00:19:27,380 --> 00:19:24,750
further explains that quote the system

411
00:19:30,140 --> 00:19:27,390
draws toxins through the soles of the

412
00:19:32,150 --> 00:19:30,150
feet unquote and that be quote water

413
00:19:36,049 --> 00:19:32,160
changes color due to the release of

414
00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:36,059
toxic substances through the mm pores of

415
00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:38,250
the soles of the feet in quote it's

416
00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:40,290
treatment sessions typically cost

417
00:19:44,860 --> 00:19:43,410
fifteen pounds to thirty pounds the

418
00:19:46,900 --> 00:19:44,870
company's website state

419
00:19:49,090 --> 00:19:46,910
that quote you'll see the excreted

420
00:19:52,030 --> 00:19:49,100
toxins in the water the water will

421
00:19:55,780 --> 00:19:52,040
change color and consistency from orange

422
00:19:57,760 --> 00:19:55,790
brown through black unquote yellow is

423
00:20:00,210 --> 00:19:57,770
said to come from the kidneys and the

424
00:20:04,810 --> 00:20:00,220
bladder orange Brown from the joints

425
00:20:08,350 --> 00:20:04,820
green dark brown to black from the liver

426
00:20:11,590 --> 00:20:08,360
gallbladder and/or bowel and white foam

427
00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:11,600
from the lymphatic system grease or fat

428
00:20:16,150 --> 00:20:13,970
particles may float to the top of the

429
00:20:18,460 --> 00:20:16,160
water according to the company the

430
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:18,470
process can be used to improve liver and

431
00:20:24,610 --> 00:20:21,650
kidney functions circulation general

432
00:20:26,310 --> 00:20:24,620
metabolism arthritis and joint pains

433
00:20:29,140 --> 00:20:26,320
headaches fatigues irritability

434
00:20:32,020 --> 00:20:29,150
menstrual pain skin problems mercury and

435
00:20:35,620 --> 00:20:32,030
heavy metal toxicity food allergies and

436
00:20:38,140 --> 00:20:35,630
poor digestion the above claims are

437
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:38,150
nonsensical most of the listed

438
00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:41,090
conditions do not have a toxic basis

439
00:20:46,510 --> 00:20:43,970
positive and negative ions cannot quote

440
00:20:49,419 --> 00:20:46,520
resonate end quote through the body in

441
00:20:53,350 --> 00:20:49,429
response to any such device and the skin

442
00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:53,360
has no ability to excrete toxins real

443
00:20:58,510 --> 00:20:55,610
detoxification of foreign substances

444
00:21:01,360 --> 00:20:58,520
takes place in the liver which modifies

445
00:21:03,910 --> 00:21:01,370
their chemical structure so they can be

446
00:21:06,540 --> 00:21:03,920
excreted by the kidneys which filter

447
00:21:08,919 --> 00:21:06,550
them from the blood into the urine the

448
00:21:12,190 --> 00:21:08,929
aqua detox is said to have been

449
00:21:15,580 --> 00:21:12,200
developed by quote doctor in quote Mary

450
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:15,590
Stags based on quote research and quote

451
00:21:21,940 --> 00:21:19,010
by Royal Rice Stags who is British

452
00:21:24,430 --> 00:21:21,950
obtained two naturopathy degrees from a

453
00:21:26,710 --> 00:21:24,440
non-accredited American Correspondence

454
00:21:29,410 --> 00:21:26,720
School and appears to do most of her

455
00:21:31,900 --> 00:21:29,420
work in Spain rife was an American

456
00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:31,910
inventor who during the 1920s claimed to

457
00:21:37,060 --> 00:21:33,970
have developed a powerful microscope

458
00:21:39,700 --> 00:21:37,070
that could detect living microbes by the

459
00:21:43,419 --> 00:21:39,710
color of auras emitted by their

460
00:21:46,210 --> 00:21:43,429
vibratory rates a survey by the science

461
00:21:49,930 --> 00:21:46,220
journalist Ray Gervin has identified at

462
00:21:53,290 --> 00:21:49,940
least 19 devices that are similar to the

463
00:21:56,710 --> 00:21:53,300
awkward detox most of the devices sell

464
00:21:58,920 --> 00:21:56,720
for about 1,000 pounds many skeptics

465
00:22:01,970 --> 00:21:58,930
suspect that the color change produced

466
00:22:05,820 --> 00:22:01,980
the awkward detox was caused by rust

467
00:22:08,190 --> 00:22:05,830
ionized iron rather than toxins Ben

468
00:22:10,740 --> 00:22:08,200
Goldacre who writes the bad science

469
00:22:13,770 --> 00:22:10,750
column for Guardian unlimited and online

470
00:22:16,740 --> 00:22:13,780
British newspaper investigated by using

471
00:22:19,350 --> 00:22:16,750
a car battery to send a current through

472
00:22:22,290 --> 00:22:19,360
two metal nails that he placed into a

473
00:22:25,650 --> 00:22:22,300
bowl of salt water the water turned

474
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:25,660
brown and developed some sludge on top

475
00:22:32,820 --> 00:22:28,290
then he sent a colleague to get a quote

476
00:22:35,910 --> 00:22:32,830
detoxed unquote and collected before and

477
00:22:38,340 --> 00:22:35,920
after water samples laboratory testing

478
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:38,350
showed that in both cases the change in

479
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:41,170
the water color was due to the greatly

480
00:22:47,340 --> 00:22:43,930
increased iron content thus it appears

481
00:22:50,430 --> 00:22:47,350
that a mccullough changes due mainly to

482
00:22:54,060 --> 00:22:50,440
the precipitation of rust created by

483
00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:54,070
corrosion of the electrodes and B the

484
00:22:59,160 --> 00:22:56,110
water would change colour regardless of

485
00:23:02,100 --> 00:22:59,170
whether or not a foot was placed in it

486
00:23:04,650 --> 00:23:02,110
the Guardian unlimited article has had

487
00:23:07,260 --> 00:23:04,660
some impact on how the aqua detox and

488
00:23:10,470 --> 00:23:07,270
its imitators are marketed some

489
00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:10,480
marketers admit that the colors are due

490
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:13,210
entirely to electrode conversion and

491
00:23:20,990 --> 00:23:17,050
there is less emphasis on toxin removal

492
00:23:24,060 --> 00:23:21,000
and more emphasis on balancing of energy

493
00:23:27,780 --> 00:23:24,070
that is not measurable with scientific

494
00:23:30,540 --> 00:23:27,790
instruments and therefore untestable but

495
00:23:33,650 --> 00:23:30,550
the bottom line is very simple all such

496
00:23:40,140 --> 00:23:33,660
devices should be considered medically

497
00:23:48,029 --> 00:23:40,150
worthless and believe it or not this

498
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:51,220
I'll link to this on the show notes but

499
00:23:55,360 --> 00:23:53,090
there's really no need to update this

500
00:23:58,720 --> 00:23:55,370
article because it's still current these

501
00:24:00,370 --> 00:23:58,730
devices are still being marketed around

502
00:24:03,820 --> 00:24:00,380
the world people are still forking out

503
00:24:07,810 --> 00:24:03,830
real money to bathe their feet and have

504
00:24:23,190 --> 00:24:07,820
the water change color a detox foot bath

505
00:24:26,649 --> 00:24:23,200
[Music]

506
00:24:28,779 --> 00:24:26,659
hey fellow skeptics in Medford here with

507
00:24:30,940 --> 00:24:28,789
Celeste reward your friendly host of

508
00:24:33,370 --> 00:24:30,950
squaring the strange a podcast that

509
00:24:35,649 --> 00:24:33,380
looks at topics ranging from legends and

510
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:35,659
cryptids and panics meaty myths

511
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:37,970
psychology and folklore breaking things

512
00:24:41,980 --> 00:24:40,250
down and picking things apart as we

513
00:24:44,529 --> 00:24:41,990
skeptics do we bring different

514
00:24:47,260 --> 00:24:44,539
perspectives to the table pleasure for

515
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:47,270
example is a witty cartoonist and Ben is

516
00:24:51,159 --> 00:24:48,890
a brilliant writer and longtime

517
00:24:53,590 --> 00:24:51,169
skeptical investigator we don't always

518
00:24:56,049 --> 00:24:53,600
agree but we have fun trying and we

519
00:24:58,750 --> 00:24:56,059
learn new things join us for new topics

520
00:25:01,270 --> 00:24:58,760
every week or two or browse our backlog

521
00:25:04,029 --> 00:25:01,280
of evergreen episodes available on

522
00:25:06,789 --> 00:25:04,039
iTunes and all your podcasts feeding

523
00:25:10,900 --> 00:25:06,799
troughs squaring the strange take care

524
00:25:10,910 --> 00:25:16,120
[Music]

525
00:25:16,130 --> 00:25:23,820
his may not spooky action at a distance

526
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:26,590
well here we are in a tin can high atop

527
00:25:29,980 --> 00:25:27,650
the world well no we're not actually

528
00:25:32,470 --> 00:25:29,990
right the second story of the Occidental

529
00:25:34,330 --> 00:25:32,480
hotel for skeptics in the pub where I

530
00:25:35,950 --> 00:25:34,340
walked in and let me tell you some Diana

531
00:25:38,710 --> 00:25:35,960
Ross was playing downstairs I'm coming

532
00:25:40,180 --> 00:25:38,720
up great track walk up here nothing not

533
00:25:41,620 --> 00:25:40,190
a crackhead not even a walk in the Black

534
00:25:42,850 --> 00:25:41,630
Forest buy her velvet which is a great

535
00:25:44,230 --> 00:25:42,860
track I recommend it to you

536
00:25:45,610 --> 00:25:44,240
tonight we're going to be hanging out

537
00:25:46,779 --> 00:25:45,620
with some skeptics seeing what's going

538
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:46,789
on who's shaking what and what they're

539
00:25:50,890 --> 00:25:48,890
shaking it out what's critical what's

540
00:25:52,210 --> 00:25:50,900
not and what's thinking and what's not

541
00:25:53,980 --> 00:25:52,220
I'll be on the side of Lee what's not

542
00:25:55,330 --> 00:25:53,990
thinking and you can decide the debate

543
00:25:57,070 --> 00:25:55,340
by round of applause at the end and a

544
00:25:58,690 --> 00:25:57,080
simple standing and walking out that's

545
00:26:01,299 --> 00:25:58,700
what's happening tonight here at skeptic

546
00:26:02,620 --> 00:26:01,309
ins and the Bubba look I am asking

547
00:26:04,180 --> 00:26:02,630
people tonight about the letter that's

548
00:26:06,700 --> 00:26:04,190
just been sent out by the Australian

549
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:06,710
skeptics to ourselves to consider about

550
00:26:09,820 --> 00:26:08,570
maybe not having psychics there doing

551
00:26:11,649 --> 00:26:09,830
shows about talking to the dead

552
00:26:13,330 --> 00:26:11,659
considering the memory of the dead could

553
00:26:14,830 --> 00:26:13,340
be important at the returned League

554
00:26:18,669 --> 00:26:14,840
Association how do you feel about that

555
00:26:20,470 --> 00:26:18,679
as an American as an American who has no

556
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:20,480
watering rights here that sounds a

557
00:26:24,340 --> 00:26:22,610
disrespectful and counterproductive give

558
00:26:27,100 --> 00:26:24,350
me a better off hiring therapists a

559
00:26:29,049 --> 00:26:27,110
similar thing going on in the USG air to

560
00:26:33,899 --> 00:26:29,059
return service club they would they have

561
00:26:35,919 --> 00:26:33,909
a most shows on like that I'm actually

562
00:26:37,510 --> 00:26:35,929
ignorant as to what the veteran

563
00:26:40,510 --> 00:26:37,520
sensation does I know they're supposed

564
00:26:42,340 --> 00:26:40,520
to provide things like health care and

565
00:26:43,419 --> 00:26:42,350
mental mental health care but you know

566
00:26:44,620 --> 00:26:43,429
if the backlog that's not really

567
00:26:45,850 --> 00:26:44,630
happening unfortunately and people with

568
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:45,860
psychic abilities isn't probably

569
00:26:53,010 --> 00:26:49,730
something you want to be supplying they

570
00:26:55,630 --> 00:26:53,020
should be supplying real health care

571
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:55,640
yes yes so should they be having psychic

572
00:27:00,100 --> 00:26:57,410
shows at ourselves when you think about

573
00:27:02,140 --> 00:27:00,110
it yeah no not at all they most said

574
00:27:04,120 --> 00:27:02,150
most definitely should not be spending

575
00:27:05,590 --> 00:27:04,130
any money on it yeah I mean it probably

576
00:27:06,700 --> 00:27:05,600
actually makes money for them when you

577
00:27:08,620 --> 00:27:06,710
think about it which is probably the

578
00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:08,630
reason why they're doing it so you're

579
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:12,010
gonna take that into account I guess

580
00:27:19,580 --> 00:27:18,200
particular with a lot of ourselves in

581
00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:19,590
New South Wales their business model is

582
00:27:23,990 --> 00:27:22,050
based upon gambling they've got a lot of

583
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:24,000
poker machines in there I don't need

584
00:27:27,950 --> 00:27:25,650
anything extra those poker machines make

585
00:27:29,180 --> 00:27:27,960
them quite a lot of money sure they do

586
00:27:32,210 --> 00:27:29,190
if you've got an opinion on this at all

587
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:32,220
so I'm not really for that idea at all

588
00:27:38,570 --> 00:27:34,770
yeah I think we should be honoring the

589
00:27:40,490 --> 00:27:38,580
servicemen and women but it's a disgrace

590
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:40,500
I think to do what they're doing yeah I

591
00:27:43,100 --> 00:27:41,730
mean do you think it's a skeptics place

592
00:27:44,030 --> 00:27:43,110
to point it out to them but I guess it

593
00:27:47,810 --> 00:27:44,040
doesn't hurt to write them letters

594
00:27:52,850 --> 00:27:51,140
all the time actually I've been do live

595
00:27:55,430 --> 00:27:52,860
shows we'll have like The Mentalist but

596
00:27:59,420 --> 00:27:55,440
there they're there to entertain we know

597
00:28:00,680 --> 00:27:59,430
to someone like banner check you guys

598
00:28:01,970 --> 00:28:00,690
look it looks like I'm reading a mind

599
00:28:03,350 --> 00:28:01,980
but I'm not really doing that yeah

600
00:28:04,970 --> 00:28:03,360
someone who's upfront about it here

601
00:28:07,340 --> 00:28:04,980
that's right yeah we know it's for

602
00:28:08,690 --> 00:28:07,350
entertainment we know it's for fun we

603
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:08,700
wonder how they do it you don't know how

604
00:28:13,250 --> 00:28:10,890
they do it but we know it's a gag it's a

605
00:28:21,500 --> 00:28:13,260
trick behind it but we don't want to

606
00:28:23,180 --> 00:28:21,510
have these thinking they're really good

607
00:28:24,500 --> 00:28:23,190
you can also pollute someone's memory by

608
00:28:25,850 --> 00:28:24,510
doing that as well you can give them the

609
00:28:27,530 --> 00:28:25,860
false impression that something's going

610
00:28:31,580 --> 00:28:27,540
on in the past that never happened at

611
00:28:33,500 --> 00:28:31,590
all yeah well how do you feel about this

612
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:33,510
whole thing of psychics at ourselves

613
00:28:37,940 --> 00:28:36,210
talking to the dead or more actually

614
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:37,950
more correctly having the dead talk back

615
00:28:42,990 --> 00:28:40,650
to them I think it's very distasteful to

616
00:28:45,070 --> 00:28:43,000
have such grief vampires coming

617
00:28:47,950 --> 00:28:45,080
places where people should be looked

618
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:47,960
after you know there may have be quite

619
00:28:52,180 --> 00:28:49,850
vulnerable they might need know you're

620
00:28:54,610 --> 00:28:52,190
looking after rather than being extorted

621
00:28:56,380 --> 00:28:54,620
yeah as I mentioned it could pollute the

622
00:28:58,260 --> 00:28:56,390
memory of the dead so actually changing

623
00:29:00,820 --> 00:28:58,270
the person's memory of the dead by

624
00:29:06,190 --> 00:29:00,830
intimating that there's this information

625
00:29:08,650 --> 00:29:06,200
from them which if they're talking about

626
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:08,660
maybe people who died in combat there's

627
00:29:12,340 --> 00:29:10,010
a lot that they can say that will be

628
00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:12,350
probably like Barnum statements yeah oh

629
00:29:15,250 --> 00:29:13,850
they were very courageous they were

630
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:15,260
other things that you can say that you

631
00:29:18,340 --> 00:29:16,730
know you're going to be onto a winner so

632
00:29:20,500 --> 00:29:18,350
their problem with that is and obviously

633
00:29:23,020 --> 00:29:20,510
they're more is to be believed which is

634
00:29:24,789 --> 00:29:23,030
just really nice I use a little bit more

635
00:29:26,230 --> 00:29:24,799
skeptical because of your English

636
00:29:28,780 --> 00:29:26,240
experience because there's a bit of a

637
00:29:33,940 --> 00:29:28,790
longer history with this thing in the UK

638
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:33,950
as it entertainment we do have plenty in

639
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:35,330
Australia but you get the big English

640
00:29:39,580 --> 00:29:37,130
ones coming here really slamming it so

641
00:29:42,130 --> 00:29:39,590
often here I have personally protested

642
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:42,140
some of the bigger names which I

643
00:29:48,340 --> 00:29:46,490
probably won't name protested and helped

644
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:48,350
hand out leaflets outside saying you

645
00:29:51,820 --> 00:29:50,210
keep an eye out for these Barnum

646
00:29:54,190 --> 00:29:51,830
statements which are likely to be coming

647
00:29:56,590 --> 00:29:54,200
out you know gone into their shows and

648
00:29:58,240 --> 00:29:56,600
seen cold reading in action I've never

649
00:30:00,669 --> 00:29:58,250
actually paid money for one because I

650
00:30:02,620 --> 00:30:00,679
just find that I've never had the money

651
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:02,630
I've gone on to cover the free ones

652
00:30:08,380 --> 00:30:05,450
before and in all honesty it's hard not

653
00:30:09,910 --> 00:30:08,390
to laugh and then of course you're seen

654
00:30:11,380 --> 00:30:09,920
as being the evil

655
00:30:12,670 --> 00:30:11,390
at the back who's laughing away through

656
00:30:14,110 --> 00:30:12,680
it I might know but I'm laughing because

657
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:14,120
she's claiming to be talking to your

658
00:30:19,390 --> 00:30:18,410
dead to our who's grasp of English might

659
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:19,400
not have been that good in the first

660
00:30:23,860 --> 00:30:21,530
place when it was alive exactly I mean

661
00:30:25,090 --> 00:30:23,870
you know I think maybe if she done it

662
00:30:27,610 --> 00:30:25,100
with a Spanish accent that could have

663
00:30:29,740 --> 00:30:27,620
been funnier and if it you if it didn't

664
00:30:32,340 --> 00:30:29,750
know not to poo in the corner how is it

665
00:30:34,780 --> 00:30:32,350
talking from the afterlife

666
00:30:40,150 --> 00:30:34,790
chewing slippers in the corner of the

667
00:30:41,980 --> 00:30:40,160
room look we've had a bit of a chat here

668
00:30:43,420 --> 00:30:41,990
we've got a couple of you people that

669
00:30:45,910 --> 00:30:43,430
are along here for the first time and

670
00:30:48,190 --> 00:30:45,920
they're also just duelist as the skeptic

671
00:30:50,620 --> 00:30:48,200
zone as well who have we got here my

672
00:30:53,020 --> 00:30:50,630
name is Michelle Demers my name is

673
00:30:54,610 --> 00:30:53,030
Heather and how did you find your way to

674
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:54,620
the Skip pick zone I mean there's plenty

675
00:30:57,340 --> 00:30:55,970
of other great podcasts to listen to

676
00:31:00,850 --> 00:30:57,350
them in Georgia rap show is much better

677
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:00,860
so while you listening to us well I'm a

678
00:31:03,970 --> 00:31:02,690
big fan of other skeptic podcasts as

679
00:31:05,500 --> 00:31:03,980
well and sometimes you know when you

680
00:31:06,910 --> 00:31:05,510
like one and you really enjoy it you end

681
00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:06,920
up looking and seeing what else is on

682
00:31:11,010 --> 00:31:08,930
there and your show came up and so what

683
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:11,020
skeptic podcast did you start with

684
00:31:16,210 --> 00:31:13,610
skeptics guide to the universe the same

685
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:16,220
thing and how did you discover that one

686
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:18,770
I discovered it from Heather's

687
00:31:24,490 --> 00:31:22,250
recommendation actually I found it on

688
00:31:26,050 --> 00:31:24,500
Spotify which I'm addicted to and I've

689
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:26,060
been addicted to it ever since

690
00:31:30,310 --> 00:31:28,730
okay that's good as the Americans can

691
00:31:32,170 --> 00:31:30,320
get their podcasts on to Spotify the

692
00:31:34,210 --> 00:31:32,180
Australians can't at the moment yeah

693
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:34,220
it's a bit centric to that yeah well

694
00:31:36,430 --> 00:31:35,210
that's good and would you make it a

695
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:36,440
little tonight we had a discussion about

696
00:31:40,030 --> 00:31:38,090
some australian indigenous history there

697
00:31:41,260 --> 00:31:40,040
yeah that was actually fascinating I

698
00:31:42,610 --> 00:31:41,270
mean we're we're both from Canada

699
00:31:44,260 --> 00:31:42,620
originally so that's not something that

700
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:44,270
we've really come across before it it's

701
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:45,890
it's interesting hearing different

702
00:31:48,790 --> 00:31:47,450
perspectives on similar issues because

703
00:31:49,990 --> 00:31:48,800
they always bring up things that you

704
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:50,000
never really thought about and it always

705
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:51,850
gives you something new to consider

706
00:31:56,390 --> 00:31:53,170
and how is the First Nation history

707
00:32:02,400 --> 00:31:56,400
treatment going up there in Canada

708
00:32:03,810 --> 00:32:02,410
probably not much better than here now

709
00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:03,820
many more Americans turned up there with

710
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:05,050
the whole Trump thing how people just

711
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:06,490
flooding across the border they're going

712
00:32:10,290 --> 00:32:08,770
I want to live here the short York your

713
00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:10,300
Prime Minister so much nicer well though

714
00:32:13,590 --> 00:32:11,530
he had that touching incident but he

715
00:32:15,870 --> 00:32:13,600
apologized eight times for it or within

716
00:32:17,430 --> 00:32:15,880
a day which is good good for me well

717
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:17,440
actually what's really interesting now

718
00:32:21,210 --> 00:32:19,090
it's like so Canada it's not a place you

719
00:32:23,010 --> 00:32:21,220
get a lot of illegal refugees it's hard

720
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:23,020
because you've got a big ocean to decide

721
00:32:25,590 --> 00:32:24,250
and then you've got a big country

722
00:32:26,670 --> 00:32:25,600
underneath it but now now you're right

723
00:32:28,230 --> 00:32:26,680
rocks you're hearing nobody legal

724
00:32:30,210 --> 00:32:28,240
refugees because the refugees in the US

725
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:30,220
and they're trying to like flee the u.s.

726
00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:32,410
so they're crossing the borders over to

727
00:32:35,940 --> 00:32:34,450
Canada it's kind of you know that hasn't

728
00:32:38,070 --> 00:32:35,950
really happened a lot on our past as far

729
00:32:40,620 --> 00:32:38,080
as I know we live in interesting times

730
00:32:44,070 --> 00:32:40,630
don't waste the Chinese might say yeah

731
00:32:45,150 --> 00:32:44,080
indeed one last question before we

732
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:45,160
finish thank you for listening to show

733
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:46,450
that's two more listeners write that

734
00:32:49,500 --> 00:32:48,010
down in the book Richard what is the

735
00:32:51,510 --> 00:32:49,510
main thing you're skeptical that one

736
00:32:52,950 --> 00:32:51,520
when one skeptical topic comes up on any

737
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:52,960
of your podcast what do you go

738
00:32:57,060 --> 00:32:54,850
oh right that's good any one you like

739
00:32:58,980 --> 00:32:57,070
particularly more than other well I

740
00:33:00,630 --> 00:32:58,990
think because I'm I'm a plant scientist

741
00:33:03,630 --> 00:33:00,640
and I work with plant genetics a lot so

742
00:33:06,510 --> 00:33:03,640
the genes yes that's another botanist

743
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:06,520
that's for now we've a lot of botanists

744
00:33:10,230 --> 00:33:08,530
we've spoken to four or five in the past

745
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:10,240
couple of weeks normally it's physicists

746
00:33:13,770 --> 00:33:11,890
you know getting all up doing them

747
00:33:15,450 --> 00:33:13,780
faster-than-light rubbish and stuff like

748
00:33:18,330 --> 00:33:15,460
that the botanists are cool favorite

749
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:18,340
plant favorite plant Adeiny amad any mo

750
00:33:22,260 --> 00:33:21,010
besom I hope the desert rose it's a it's

751
00:33:23,550 --> 00:33:22,270
mostly I just like because it's

752
00:33:25,890 --> 00:33:23,560
beautiful I'm just gonna be frank about

753
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:25,900
that but they grow like bonsai they have

754
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:27,490
this really beautiful base and they have

755
00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:28,810
these gorgeous flowers and they grow

756
00:33:32,460 --> 00:33:30,370
like bonsai but you don't actually have

757
00:33:34,590 --> 00:33:32,470
to trim them so they're like zero work

758
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:34,600
bonsai which is amazing would we have

759
00:33:37,650 --> 00:33:35,890
anything like that in Australia you've

760
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:37,660
seen oh all over the place yeah they're

761
00:33:42,030 --> 00:33:39,250
like common potted plants you find them

762
00:33:43,530 --> 00:33:42,040
in people's gardens yeah some rare thing

763
00:33:46,259 --> 00:33:43,540
would have to order in a shop in that

764
00:33:48,719 --> 00:33:47,549
absolutely are but here you actually

765
00:33:50,070 --> 00:33:48,729
have the climate for us so here we think

766
00:33:51,539 --> 00:33:50,080
there go back home we think they're

767
00:33:52,969 --> 00:33:51,549
totally exotic but here it's a couple's

768
00:33:55,109 --> 00:33:52,979
got them in their front yard no big deal

769
00:33:56,879 --> 00:33:55,119
as I've said before on the show I'm a

770
00:33:57,329 --> 00:33:56,889
fan of the Western Australian picture

771
00:34:00,810 --> 00:33:57,339
plant

772
00:34:02,820 --> 00:34:00,820
to grow because it lives in swampy marsh

773
00:34:04,649 --> 00:34:02,830
regions and like acidic soil so unless

774
00:34:07,229 --> 00:34:04,659
you are trending it daily like a

775
00:34:08,730 --> 00:34:07,239
tropical tank and fish it'll die which

776
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:08,740
I've kill three of them so I don't do

777
00:34:12,930 --> 00:34:10,450
any more I'm not your area of science

778
00:34:14,339 --> 00:34:12,940
you interested in well it has to be

779
00:34:16,470 --> 00:34:14,349
environmental science I'm actually

780
00:34:18,750 --> 00:34:16,480
studying sustainability so not the

781
00:34:20,399 --> 00:34:18,760
scientific side of things but just how

782
00:34:23,460 --> 00:34:20,409
people can live more sustainably within

783
00:34:25,799 --> 00:34:23,470
the earth the world because as you can

784
00:34:27,389 --> 00:34:25,809
imagine with seven billion people

785
00:34:29,639 --> 00:34:27,399
there's a lot of things we need to work

786
00:34:33,419 --> 00:34:29,649
out how to do better so we can you know

787
00:34:35,700 --> 00:34:33,429
get the long haul in just you've just an

788
00:34:37,079 --> 00:34:35,710
the Russians are just feels the Canadian

789
00:34:39,240 --> 00:34:37,089
election and made you president of the

790
00:34:41,669 --> 00:34:39,250
world okay thank you Russians now what's

791
00:34:43,559 --> 00:34:41,679
the first thing you would do as that to

792
00:34:48,649 --> 00:34:43,569
environmentally save the place the first

793
00:34:52,169 --> 00:34:50,940
I'm still learning and I'm happy to say

794
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:52,179
I'm still learning look there are lots

795
00:34:55,470 --> 00:34:53,770
and lots of little things but I really

796
00:34:56,789 --> 00:34:55,480
do think one thing I can say with some

797
00:34:59,250 --> 00:34:56,799
confidence at this point is that

798
00:35:00,930 --> 00:34:59,260
government does have to lead the way and

799
00:35:04,140 --> 00:35:00,940
it's definitely not not in this country

800
00:35:05,789 --> 00:35:04,150
not really anywhere house Canada going

801
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:05,799
with deregulation it's not moving in

802
00:35:10,049 --> 00:35:08,770
that way like the u.s. is is it it's

803
00:35:13,010 --> 00:35:10,059
kind of cheaper people think it's a

804
00:35:17,150 --> 00:35:13,020
saving money by doing that but now

805
00:35:19,190 --> 00:35:17,160
no luckily well now we've got up okay I

806
00:35:21,140 --> 00:35:19,200
don't think Trudeau is into too much

807
00:35:23,150 --> 00:35:21,150
deregulation that would be one good

808
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:23,160
thing about him he's not very

809
00:35:27,590 --> 00:35:25,410
environmentally friendly but you know

810
00:35:29,630 --> 00:35:27,600
there's obviously so many varying

811
00:35:32,450 --> 00:35:29,640
factions that want what they want so he

812
00:35:33,620 --> 00:35:32,460
can only do so much I really don't know

813
00:35:34,730 --> 00:35:33,630
what they're doing economically at the

814
00:35:36,380 --> 00:35:34,740
moment I know conservatives are

815
00:35:38,740 --> 00:35:36,390
complaining about him economically so

816
00:35:40,700 --> 00:35:38,750
that must mean he is regulating things

817
00:35:42,650 --> 00:35:40,710
thank you both for listening to the show

818
00:35:44,060 --> 00:35:42,660
and I must congratulate Canada on having

819
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:44,070
the only defense minister that's come

820
00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:45,330
out publicly and admitted to the

821
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:47,130
existence of UFOs

822
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:49,290
he's about 96 now he was that your

823
00:35:53,330 --> 00:35:51,690
defense minister during the 60s and he

824
00:35:56,420 --> 00:35:53,340
says yep they realize all the stuff so

825
00:35:58,190 --> 00:35:56,430
good I he well he saw the stuff and you

826
00:35:59,540 --> 00:35:58,200
know in fact he's been telling people so

827
00:36:00,740 --> 00:35:59,550
long he's gone off that now and going to

828
00:36:03,170 --> 00:36:00,750
do something else cuz people won't

829
00:36:04,850 --> 00:36:03,180
listen to him well I'm gonna say poly

830
00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:04,860
means many and tics are little blood

831
00:36:11,240 --> 00:36:09,290
sucking creatures okay thank you

832
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:11,250
well Richard it's been happening in

833
00:36:13,730 --> 00:36:12,570
skeptics in the pub tonight there's a

834
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:13,740
hub up in the background but it has a

835
00:36:17,300 --> 00:36:15,450
bit of a wash up and it's been a bit of

836
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:17,310
arm wrestling it's been fun it's time I

837
00:36:20,390 --> 00:36:19,050
went and washed up in fact I think I am

838
00:36:23,720 --> 00:36:20,400
washed up may now that's the problem

839
00:36:25,970 --> 00:36:23,730
it's been hushing flushing and some

840
00:36:27,620 --> 00:36:25,980
occasional fussing but it's all been fun

841
00:36:29,780 --> 00:36:27,630
it's all been fun at skeptics in the pub

842
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:29,790
and I hope we see a big crowd here next

843
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:31,530
month the first Thursday of the month

844
00:36:35,330 --> 00:36:33,810
ride cool and don't forget the

845
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:35,340
conference people get it expect it's

846
00:36:37,370 --> 00:36:36,210
gonna be a big time

847
00:36:40,190 --> 00:36:37,380
and it's the one time of the year I

848
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:40,200
really dress up yes that's right the one

849
00:36:53,930 --> 00:37:01,940
[Music]

850
00:37:07,980 --> 00:37:05,760
yes simply idiot hey Sal you guys guys I

851
00:37:09,900 --> 00:37:07,990
just had the most amazing experience

852
00:37:11,549 --> 00:37:09,910
what experience on dress under Chevy

853
00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:11,559
been to the pub children nuts hang out

854
00:37:16,109 --> 00:37:13,690
with mash you know he was blessed by

855
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:16,119
peter Popoff no Yellin I'm not talking

856
00:37:20,940 --> 00:37:18,970
about psychics it was a really SP

857
00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:20,950
experience now you have been to the pub

858
00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:22,690
either that or you've been smoking

859
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:23,170
something

860
00:37:27,900 --> 00:37:25,690
no punters the ESB is the European

861
00:37:30,059 --> 00:37:27,910
sceptics podcast it's the most amazing

862
00:37:31,859 --> 00:37:30,069
thing you get to know so much about

863
00:37:34,799 --> 00:37:31,869
sceptics and their activities across

864
00:37:36,569 --> 00:37:34,809
Europe you know events hot topics and

865
00:37:38,789 --> 00:37:36,579
interviews with lots of interesting

866
00:37:40,109 --> 00:37:38,799
people oh wow cool by the way pointers

867
00:37:42,539 --> 00:37:40,119
you just come into the false dichotomy

868
00:37:45,809 --> 00:37:42,549
fallacy I guess that means I'm really

869
00:37:47,819 --> 00:37:45,819
wrong yep and you can even learn about

870
00:37:50,309 --> 00:37:47,829
those fallacies in the show and hear

871
00:37:52,559 --> 00:37:50,319
about people spreading silly ideas you

872
00:37:55,559 --> 00:37:52,569
should really check it out it's the ESP

873
00:37:58,440 --> 00:37:55,569
the European sceptics podcast it's on

874
00:38:00,569 --> 00:37:58,450
never weak alright so where can I get

875
00:38:03,240 --> 00:38:00,579
this is the experience it sounds good

876
00:38:06,329 --> 00:38:03,250
you can go online at the ESP do to you

877
00:38:09,359 --> 00:38:06,339
follow it on twitter at es podcast

878
00:38:11,490 --> 00:38:09,369
underscore EU or like the podcast on

879
00:38:14,549 --> 00:38:11,500
Facebook oh and you can also contact the

880
00:38:18,390 --> 00:38:14,559
show by sending them an email to info at

881
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:18,400
the ESPE you and if you want to

882
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:20,410
subscribe do a quick search for the

883
00:38:26,700 --> 00:38:23,170
European skeptic podcast on soundcloud

884
00:38:56,430 --> 00:38:54,480
I don't know why you can't believe I'm

885
00:38:58,920 --> 00:38:56,440
joining me now all the way from Prague

886
00:39:02,520 --> 00:38:58,930
it's clear Klingon boat once again hello

887
00:39:04,410 --> 00:39:02,530
Claire hi nice to be back yeah wonderful

888
00:39:06,150 --> 00:39:04,420
to have you back on the sceptic zone now

889
00:39:08,190 --> 00:39:06,160
the last time we spoke to you a few

890
00:39:11,670 --> 00:39:08,200
weeks ago you were telling us about your

891
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:11,680
upcoming trip to Scotland and Germany

892
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:14,410
first of all how was Scotland how did

893
00:39:19,500 --> 00:39:17,650
that go it was awesome the Edinburgh

894
00:39:21,870 --> 00:39:19,510
skeptics are doing a great job at the

895
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:21,880
Fringe they had to talk every night for

896
00:39:27,540 --> 00:39:25,210
20 days straight it was really really

897
00:39:29,370 --> 00:39:27,550
something and in Glasgow was fantastic

898
00:39:32,460 --> 00:39:29,380
to do Glasgow skeptics they have talks

899
00:39:35,070 --> 00:39:32,470
every Monday and they're incredibly

900
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:35,080
prepared and friendly in there it was a

901
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:38,530
wonderful trip all around it sounds like

902
00:39:42,870 --> 00:39:40,690
you had a great time and I'm I'm jealous

903
00:39:45,450 --> 00:39:42,880
of your trip to Scotland but probably

904
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:45,460
and maybe possibly even more so jealous

905
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:47,770
about your trip to Germany because and

906
00:39:52,710 --> 00:39:50,170
folks I will link to this on the show

907
00:39:55,829 --> 00:39:52,720
notes you were involved in some testing

908
00:39:58,170 --> 00:39:55,839
of some paranormal activity which was

909
00:40:01,440 --> 00:39:58,180
all recorded by a Deutsche Welle or some

910
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:01,450
German TV network what can you tell us

911
00:40:08,190 --> 00:40:04,450
about that well Martin monitor from the

912
00:40:09,839 --> 00:40:08,200
GWP the German skeptics invited us to

913
00:40:11,700 --> 00:40:09,849
come over and see their testing because

914
00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:11,710
the German skeptics to do testing only

915
00:40:15,660 --> 00:40:13,330
once a year always in the summer in

916
00:40:18,540 --> 00:40:15,670
August and so it was really exciting for

917
00:40:20,190 --> 00:40:18,550
us go to see how they do their

918
00:40:23,190 --> 00:40:20,200
paranormal challenges their paranormal

919
00:40:25,230 --> 00:40:23,200
experiments they had two candidates this

920
00:40:31,500 --> 00:40:25,240
year the first one was a dowser and the

921
00:40:34,260 --> 00:40:31,510
second one was an engineer who thought

922
00:40:36,359 --> 00:40:34,270
he could detect a new type of

923
00:40:39,540 --> 00:40:36,369
electromagnetic field that was generated

924
00:40:42,330 --> 00:40:39,550
by the universe or by

925
00:40:46,380 --> 00:40:42,340
higher power so that was a kind of an

926
00:40:50,550 --> 00:40:46,390
unclear thing he he's like he worked his

927
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:50,560
whole life as a antenna engineer and he

928
00:40:54,900 --> 00:40:52,650
tried to apply that knowledge to

929
00:40:57,720 --> 00:40:54,910
creating a special pendulum that could

930
00:40:59,460 --> 00:40:57,730
measure this ultra magnetic field yes it

931
00:41:01,980 --> 00:40:59,470
was it was fascinating to watch the

932
00:41:03,660 --> 00:41:01,990
video and I encourage everybody even

933
00:41:05,610 --> 00:41:03,670
though the videos in German you don't

934
00:41:07,980 --> 00:41:05,620
need to understand German to see what's

935
00:41:10,530 --> 00:41:07,990
going on it's a scientific test Clara

936
00:41:11,730 --> 00:41:10,540
Klien Berg is there taking part and lots

937
00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:11,740
of other people

938
00:41:16,470 --> 00:41:13,810
we've got a dowser award a diviner

939
00:41:19,500 --> 00:41:16,480
looking for water and this man with his

940
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:19,510
pendulum and it's just it's just so

941
00:41:24,780 --> 00:41:21,370
classic isn't it clear that the dowser

942
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:24,790
and somebody with the pendulum it's it's

943
00:41:28,410 --> 00:41:26,650
like the good old good old days of

944
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:28,420
skepticism isn't it that's true that's

945
00:41:32,310 --> 00:41:30,850
true it's always interesting to see

946
00:41:36,330 --> 00:41:32,320
these tests how different people react

947
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:36,340
to unfortunately always having their

948
00:41:45,270 --> 00:41:40,450
beliefs squashed in a way the dowser he

949
00:41:48,450 --> 00:41:45,280
was a construction worker who uses his

950
00:41:51,930 --> 00:41:48,460
thousand thousand rods to find cables

951
00:41:54,750 --> 00:41:51,940
and but for some reason for the tests he

952
00:41:56,310 --> 00:41:54,760
wanted to find water and then he said if

953
00:41:58,650 --> 00:41:56,320
we were to skip those cables he could

954
00:42:01,350 --> 00:41:58,660
have found him but he didn't say that

955
00:42:03,240 --> 00:42:01,360
ahead of time so and he came just kind

956
00:42:06,540 --> 00:42:03,250
of turned around and left and was in big

957
00:42:08,490 --> 00:42:06,550
deal but the second guy because he wrote

958
00:42:10,970 --> 00:42:08,500
already two books about his method and

959
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:10,980
he was really much invested into it he

960
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:17,130
didn't believe that he could be wrong

961
00:42:26,190 --> 00:42:20,290
and his son was our son-in-law was there

962
00:42:28,530 --> 00:42:26,200
with him as well and both of them said

963
00:42:31,860 --> 00:42:28,540
that if they would have done it at home

964
00:42:33,240 --> 00:42:31,870
in the forest where they lived it would

965
00:42:36,900 --> 00:42:33,250
have worked out but because of the

966
00:42:38,910 --> 00:42:36,910
strange conditions that were there they

967
00:42:40,710 --> 00:42:38,920
couldn't even though that they came in

968
00:42:42,270 --> 00:42:40,720
there a day earlier to set everything up

969
00:42:43,500 --> 00:42:42,280
and measure everything before the

970
00:42:45,570 --> 00:42:43,510
experiments the next day and they had

971
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:45,580
chance to redo everything according to

972
00:42:50,250 --> 00:42:47,770
their wishes so but it's always like

973
00:42:52,030 --> 00:42:50,260
that well you're absolutely right and

974
00:42:54,580 --> 00:42:52,040
watching it I was

975
00:42:57,310 --> 00:42:54,590
almost anticipating waiting for the

976
00:42:59,110 --> 00:42:57,320
excuses or the ration rationale to come

977
00:43:02,770 --> 00:42:59,120
through and this is always the case I

978
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:02,780
mean I've done various tests of water

979
00:43:05,470 --> 00:43:04,490
the miners over the years and we wait

980
00:43:07,810 --> 00:43:05,480
for this to happen

981
00:43:11,020 --> 00:43:07,820
I think the famous one is James Randi

982
00:43:13,390 --> 00:43:11,030
where he did the test in Australia and

983
00:43:15,460 --> 00:43:13,400
out came all the excuses but it's it's

984
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:15,470
it's a part of psychology we we know

985
00:43:20,650 --> 00:43:18,170
about when people fail at something may

986
00:43:24,700 --> 00:43:20,660
they know they can do then they look for

987
00:43:26,140 --> 00:43:24,710
a reason as to why they failed you can

988
00:43:28,210 --> 00:43:26,150
see it on the video but what was

989
00:43:30,510 --> 00:43:28,220
interesting moment when the results were

990
00:43:34,510 --> 00:43:30,520
being revealed with the second gentleman

991
00:43:39,490 --> 00:43:34,520
so they always did the test in sets of

992
00:43:40,900 --> 00:43:39,500
tens so we doctor mph who was the head

993
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:40,910
of an experiment he was revealing the

994
00:43:45,910 --> 00:43:43,850
first and second ten results and they

995
00:43:47,770 --> 00:43:45,920
were like eighty percent seventy percent

996
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:47,780
successful as it was interesting for us

997
00:43:52,090 --> 00:43:49,970
to see like oh my god this actually

998
00:43:53,830 --> 00:43:52,100
could you know work out and but the

999
00:43:56,710 --> 00:43:53,840
gentleman said oh you know this is this

1000
00:43:59,410 --> 00:43:56,720
is kind of this result is bad because I

1001
00:44:00,910 --> 00:43:59,420
didn't you know feel it that way or

1002
00:44:03,460 --> 00:44:00,920
something like that and then we got to

1003
00:44:05,110 --> 00:44:03,470
do other results and then the real magic

1004
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:05,120
came into play which is for me

1005
00:44:12,730 --> 00:44:08,810
statistics and it all evened itself out

1006
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:12,740
and it was 5050 in the end yeah yeah

1007
00:44:17,530 --> 00:44:14,690
well again folks our link to this video

1008
00:44:19,810 --> 00:44:17,540
in the show notes and I urge you to

1009
00:44:21,910 --> 00:44:19,820
watch it even though it's in German it

1010
00:44:23,470 --> 00:44:21,920
doesn't matter you'll see the scientific

1011
00:44:25,300 --> 00:44:23,480
process in action you'll see the

1012
00:44:30,970 --> 00:44:25,310
randomization and you'll see clear

1013
00:44:32,650 --> 00:44:30,980
Klingenberg on German TV yes what fun

1014
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:32,660
well congratulations Claire I'm so

1015
00:44:37,930 --> 00:44:34,130
pleased that you were able to take part

1016
00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:37,940
in that I know for any skeptic it's

1017
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:40,010
always an interesting and deeply

1018
00:44:46,420 --> 00:44:42,170
fascinating thing to do to take part in

1019
00:44:49,630 --> 00:44:46,430
a test of paranormal power exactly and

1020
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:49,640
now into the Czech Republic we are

1021
00:44:56,020 --> 00:44:51,530
currently going through the process of

1022
00:44:58,300 --> 00:44:56,030
finally getting the bunker so for our

1023
00:45:01,150 --> 00:44:58,310
testing we went to visit it and it looks

1024
00:45:03,550 --> 00:45:01,160
really really cool and it has a lot of

1025
00:45:04,359 --> 00:45:03,560
room for testing and we hope to test

1026
00:45:06,339 --> 00:45:04,369
people on our own

1027
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:06,349
Republic but from other countries as

1028
00:45:12,009 --> 00:45:08,690
well so give us a shout out if he want

1029
00:45:14,529 --> 00:45:12,019
to use our bunker and if you ever need

1030
00:45:19,859 --> 00:45:14,539
an international consultant who's who's

1031
00:45:21,549 --> 00:45:19,869
done a few tests just let me know that's

1032
00:45:23,349 --> 00:45:21,559
just wonderful

1033
00:45:25,029 --> 00:45:23,359
we'll play a Klingon burg once again

1034
00:45:26,319 --> 00:45:25,039
from the Czech Republic thank you very

1035
00:45:48,249 --> 00:45:26,329
much for that update

1036
00:45:49,900 --> 00:45:48,259
all right hi I get a I'm gonna cow and I

1037
00:45:52,809 --> 00:45:49,910
wanted to be speaking at skeptic on

1038
00:45:54,009 --> 00:45:52,819
Australia 2018 and first were the

1039
00:45:56,589 --> 00:45:54,019
hippies right when they said that

1040
00:45:58,539 --> 00:45:56,599
reality is only for people who can't

1041
00:46:00,279 --> 00:45:58,549
handle drugs well we're going to explore

1042
00:46:02,470 --> 00:46:00,289
that so what is the real color of the

1043
00:46:05,829 --> 00:46:02,480
universe do people use only 10% of their

1044
00:46:09,309 --> 00:46:05,839
brain do the seven deadly sins actually

1045
00:46:12,249 --> 00:46:09,319
still exist do diet drinks get you drunk

1046
00:46:14,769 --> 00:46:12,259
er how can you tell quickly if a list of

1047
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:14,779
numbers is faked and are we living in

1048
00:46:20,079 --> 00:46:17,930
the best or the worst of times and what

1049
00:46:23,229 --> 00:46:20,089
generates more power on a weight per

1050
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:23,239
weight and volume 4 volume basis the Sun

1051
00:46:29,100 --> 00:46:25,970
or your compost pile and worst of all

1052
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:29,110
I'll tell you the real truth about set

1053
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:31,010
[Music]

1054
00:46:36,970 --> 00:46:33,650
meet dr. Karl cruelly skiing at

1055
00:46:39,970 --> 00:46:36,980
skeptical 2018 the Australian skeptics

1056
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:39,980
National Convention October the 13th and

1057
00:46:45,490 --> 00:46:42,770
14th at the Concours Chatswood tickets

1058
00:47:06,250 --> 00:46:45,500
available at Convention not skeptics

1059
00:47:08,650 --> 00:47:06,260
dot-com got a you on Saturday the 8th of

1060
00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:08,660
September a small but happy band of

1061
00:47:14,260 --> 00:47:10,970
Australian skeptics headed for the town

1062
00:47:17,410 --> 00:47:14,270
whole blood donation center interested

1063
00:47:20,370 --> 00:47:17,420
in doing our bit for the general health

1064
00:47:23,620 --> 00:47:20,380
of the community on hand was Maynard

1065
00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:23,630
look as Adam West once said to Burt Ward

1066
00:47:27,970 --> 00:47:25,490
in that great Batman movie cabaret

1067
00:47:30,070 --> 00:47:27,980
cabaret a life is a cabaret old chum and

1068
00:47:31,450 --> 00:47:30,080
indeed Sydney is not really a place you

1069
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:31,460
should get up at 4 12 o'clock on a

1070
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:33,050
Saturday morning really over a hell of a

1071
00:47:36,099 --> 00:47:34,490
day there's no people running around

1072
00:47:37,780 --> 00:47:36,109
with their children taken to support but

1073
00:47:38,830 --> 00:47:37,790
here's some people doing a community

1074
00:47:40,150 --> 00:47:38,840
minded thing that's actually going to

1075
00:47:42,010 --> 00:47:40,160
help people instead of whinging about

1076
00:47:44,590 --> 00:47:42,020
like I am on a Saturday morning we've

1077
00:47:46,510 --> 00:47:44,600
got the sceptics here in the foyer of

1078
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:46,520
the blood bank about to give some blood

1079
00:47:49,930 --> 00:47:48,170
we've got the usual people but I ran how

1080
00:47:51,840 --> 00:47:49,940
are you I'm very good thank you

1081
00:47:55,690 --> 00:47:51,850
have another blood give a hello hi

1082
00:47:58,359 --> 00:47:55,700
Richard I'm halfway through filling out

1083
00:48:00,550 --> 00:47:58,369
page 6 and volume 3 of the questionnaire

1084
00:48:01,840 --> 00:48:00,560
I know I know you well I'm not quite

1085
00:48:03,730 --> 00:48:01,850
sure you've done three of those things

1086
00:48:05,260 --> 00:48:03,740
but anyway overdue Alethea to have you

1087
00:48:07,330 --> 00:48:05,270
filled out the form you had to fill out

1088
00:48:11,200 --> 00:48:07,340
I'm not eligible to donate blood in

1089
00:48:13,060 --> 00:48:11,210
Australia um why was that well you said

1090
00:48:16,330 --> 00:48:13,070
you said the wrong thing to mr. Dutton

1091
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:16,340
I'm classified as a Mad Cow really

1092
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:17,810
because you are you you you've you've

1093
00:48:19,940 --> 00:48:18,890
been in a place where there could be

1094
00:48:22,430 --> 00:48:19,950
prions or something

1095
00:48:24,410 --> 00:48:22,440
[Music]

1096
00:48:26,300 --> 00:48:24,420
people who've lived in the UK during a

1097
00:48:29,140 --> 00:48:26,310
certain period of time are not permitted

1098
00:48:31,940 --> 00:48:29,150
to donate in Australia really yeah

1099
00:48:33,380 --> 00:48:31,950
disease yes I know

1100
00:48:35,210 --> 00:48:33,390
and they don't and they can't test fit

1101
00:48:36,410 --> 00:48:35,220
is that the problem or they won't test

1102
00:48:40,430 --> 00:48:36,420
for it but either way I'm also

1103
00:48:43,670 --> 00:48:40,440
underweight for the there's two reasons

1104
00:48:44,809 --> 00:48:43,680
you can't do it my mind my reasons just

1105
00:48:46,130 --> 00:48:44,819
crap because I'm really scared and don't

1106
00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:46,140
like needles and stuff in that and I was

1107
00:48:50,390 --> 00:48:48,210
just yeah I can't even look behind me

1108
00:48:52,609 --> 00:48:50,400
that's just a foyer you're here to

1109
00:48:56,930 --> 00:48:52,619
report for the sceptic zone and I baked

1110
00:49:00,140 --> 00:48:56,940
cookies for our generous donors did you

1111
00:49:02,569 --> 00:49:00,150
make parmesan stables and spiced ginger

1112
00:49:04,099 --> 00:49:02,579
cookies what's that seemed to be going

1113
00:49:05,089 --> 00:49:04,109
pretty well there and now you're gonna

1114
00:49:07,579 --> 00:49:05,099
the questionnaire but should anything

1115
00:49:09,380 --> 00:49:07,589
that might make you eligible I hope not

1116
00:49:10,940 --> 00:49:09,390
I I'm going through everything it's

1117
00:49:13,790 --> 00:49:10,950
asking you where I've been what I've

1118
00:49:15,770 --> 00:49:13,800
been eating blah blah blah I heard you

1119
00:49:17,740 --> 00:49:15,780
been eating what I can tell that five

1120
00:49:20,720 --> 00:49:17,750
being mixed from Aldi yeah that's right

1121
00:49:22,130 --> 00:49:20,730
it says here to make sure I've been

1122
00:49:23,720 --> 00:49:22,140
drinking lots order which I have been

1123
00:49:25,329 --> 00:49:23,730
all morning I'm glad they've got

1124
00:49:28,130 --> 00:49:25,339
bathrooms here I can tell you that much

1125
00:49:30,260 --> 00:49:28,140
and are there many people around you

1126
00:49:31,730 --> 00:49:30,270
this morning I'm having someone look

1127
00:49:33,710 --> 00:49:31,740
towards where the blood will be taken

1128
00:49:35,089 --> 00:49:33,720
even roughly but we haven't well there's

1129
00:49:36,170 --> 00:49:35,099
some people downstairs we can see I

1130
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:36,180
don't know if there's no that's a food

1131
00:49:39,470 --> 00:49:37,890
court no I got that wrong no there are

1132
00:49:41,599 --> 00:49:39,480
too many people here but we're here only

1133
00:49:43,579 --> 00:49:41,609
well I said what Disick is up to our via

1134
00:49:45,740 --> 00:49:43,589
Jessica I believe you're gonna be giving

1135
00:49:47,450 --> 00:49:45,750
some blood here this morning how you

1136
00:49:49,700 --> 00:49:47,460
going with the rather extensive

1137
00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:49,710
questionnaire oh it's extremely

1138
00:49:53,210 --> 00:49:51,690
extensive an example of one of these

1139
00:49:56,319 --> 00:49:53,220
strange questions that people might not

1140
00:49:58,430 --> 00:49:56,329
expect would be on their anything odd

1141
00:50:00,380 --> 00:49:58,440
what's interesting what they're looking

1142
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:00,390
for so they're asking you if you've had

1143
00:50:04,460 --> 00:50:01,770
in the toy in the last 12 months an

1144
00:50:06,470 --> 00:50:04,470
illness with both a rash and swollen

1145
00:50:08,809 --> 00:50:06,480
glands with or without a fever so

1146
00:50:10,460 --> 00:50:08,819
obviously they're trying to pin down

1147
00:50:12,170 --> 00:50:10,470
whether you might have had some sort of

1148
00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:12,180
illness that they might be concerned

1149
00:50:16,180 --> 00:50:14,090
about yeah okay

1150
00:50:17,710 --> 00:50:16,190
all sorts of questions they like and

1151
00:50:20,050 --> 00:50:17,720
that the concerned about mad cow disease

1152
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:20,060
oh yes I want to know if you've been to

1153
00:50:22,780 --> 00:50:21,530
a dentist in the last week because we

1154
00:50:24,130 --> 00:50:22,790
all know hanging around with dentists is

1155
00:50:27,250 --> 00:50:24,140
not a good idea the best of times

1156
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:27,260
Oh - right I just I stay away as much as

1157
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:28,850
often as often as possible

1158
00:50:31,270 --> 00:50:29,930
good luck that they think you're gonna

1159
00:50:32,530 --> 00:50:31,280
pass because they look good often

1160
00:50:34,120 --> 00:50:32,540
there's a simple test and you hadn't

1161
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:34,130
thought about and they go on your answer

1162
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:35,330
yes or no and then that's it

1163
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:37,490
yeah well this stuff here I've never

1164
00:50:42,100 --> 00:50:39,410
even heard of I mean what's shaggers

1165
00:50:43,420 --> 00:50:42,110
disease that's something that's under

1166
00:50:46,420 --> 00:50:43,430
the question have you ever had malaria

1167
00:50:48,610 --> 00:50:46,430
Ross River fever Q fever lip toe

1168
00:50:50,740 --> 00:50:48,620
cirrhosis or shaggers disease now

1169
00:50:52,900 --> 00:50:50,750
imagine it's related to that but well

1170
00:50:57,340 --> 00:50:52,910
good luck with that I hope you've got

1171
00:50:58,300 --> 00:50:57,350
your GP on a speed dial speed and how do

1172
00:51:07,960 --> 00:50:58,310
you go around with any of the questions

1173
00:51:09,910 --> 00:51:07,970
tough for you yes the one about sex well

1174
00:51:12,340 --> 00:51:09,920
it is fairly um yeah it's like oh let me

1175
00:51:14,770 --> 00:51:12,350
think yeah well you know because it goes

1176
00:51:17,230 --> 00:51:14,780
back to ages you'd be basically it's

1177
00:51:19,390 --> 00:51:17,240
it's pretty much ever yeah have you ever

1178
00:51:21,310 --> 00:51:19,400
had what some of the questions I must

1179
00:51:24,370 --> 00:51:21,320
admit I find I am a regular blot or know

1180
00:51:28,210 --> 00:51:24,380
this I didn't donate today I donated a

1181
00:51:30,670 --> 00:51:28,220
couple of days ago and he was my 38th

1182
00:51:32,350 --> 00:51:30,680
donation in Australia yeah

1183
00:51:36,310 --> 00:51:32,360
I still find the ones that ask about

1184
00:51:38,470 --> 00:51:36,320
male to male sex offensive I find that

1185
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:38,480
the discrimination against gay came in

1186
00:51:44,050 --> 00:51:41,450
in blood donation is unwarranted the

1187
00:51:45,670 --> 00:51:44,060
evidence is very much against it so

1188
00:51:46,990 --> 00:51:45,680
maybe that's a campaign that we should

1189
00:51:48,760 --> 00:51:47,000
engage in one day and that was a

1190
00:51:50,140 --> 00:51:48,770
hangover from the 90s when I first

1191
00:51:51,820 --> 00:51:50,150
introduced that question that just kind

1192
00:51:54,430 --> 00:51:51,830
of lifted in well they're trying to

1193
00:51:55,690 --> 00:51:54,440
reduce the potential risk to blood

1194
00:51:57,760 --> 00:51:55,700
recipients which is completely

1195
00:52:00,810 --> 00:51:57,770
understandable except that the risk to

1196
00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:00,820
blood recipients today from gay men is

1197
00:52:10,290 --> 00:52:08,460
the increased risk is is tiny and blood

1198
00:52:11,670 --> 00:52:10,300
is tested anyway so it's unwarranted

1199
00:52:13,980 --> 00:52:11,680
it's just discrimination yeah so I do

1200
00:52:18,200 --> 00:52:13,990
find that difficult not for myself to

1201
00:52:21,030 --> 00:52:18,210
answer but from an emotional and logical

1202
00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:21,040
perspective and how do you prepare

1203
00:52:24,060 --> 00:52:22,810
yourself for your blood donation since

1204
00:52:25,530 --> 00:52:24,070
you give it so regulate how do you

1205
00:52:27,260 --> 00:52:25,540
prepare you drink lots of water or the

1206
00:52:30,930 --> 00:52:27,270
day before do you ate a special way I

1207
00:52:32,850 --> 00:52:30,940
just just normal I make sure usually I

1208
00:52:35,070 --> 00:52:32,860
just eat something to you I usually

1209
00:52:36,540 --> 00:52:35,080
don't eat in the morning so but on if I

1210
00:52:39,510 --> 00:52:36,550
give blood then I do eat in the morning

1211
00:52:41,820 --> 00:52:39,520
I drink a little bit it's I don't have

1212
00:52:45,150 --> 00:52:41,830
any effect from blood donation so for me

1213
00:52:47,280 --> 00:52:45,160
it's quite easy yeah but it's look it's

1214
00:52:48,810 --> 00:52:47,290
a great thing to do in the blood the Red

1215
00:52:50,220 --> 00:52:48,820
Cross blood bank started doing this

1216
00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:50,230
thing in the last few years where they

1217
00:52:55,110 --> 00:52:52,570
they let you know what's been done with

1218
00:52:57,260 --> 00:52:55,120
your blood in January general terms so

1219
00:53:00,570 --> 00:52:57,270
you get a text message a few days later

1220
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:00,580
saying something like your blood is just

1221
00:53:06,150 --> 00:53:04,090
saved a savior life at John Hunter

1222
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:06,160
Hospital and Newcastle or something like

1223
00:53:10,020 --> 00:53:08,410
that it's it's you know it's great it's

1224
00:53:14,760 --> 00:53:10,030
it gives you a great feeling that you're

1225
00:53:17,310 --> 00:53:14,770
doing the right thing it's about an hour

1226
00:53:20,460 --> 00:53:17,320
later cub reporter Richard Saunders here

1227
00:53:23,040 --> 00:53:20,470
filling in for main art we've repaired

1228
00:53:24,330 --> 00:53:23,050
to a local hotel to have a glass of

1229
00:53:33,540 --> 00:53:24,340
water because we're not allowed to drink

1230
00:53:36,330 --> 00:53:33,550
alcohol or so they tell us and we we did

1231
00:53:38,370 --> 00:53:36,340
the routine we had our interviews lots

1232
00:53:40,170 --> 00:53:38,380
of paperwork and then we went through

1233
00:53:41,910 --> 00:53:40,180
Jessica and you and I was sort of

1234
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:41,920
opposite each other making faces while

1235
00:53:47,490 --> 00:53:44,290
heavy had blood drawn will I've broke my

1236
00:53:48,900 --> 00:53:47,500
arm bandaged up so of you while wearing

1237
00:53:51,690 --> 00:53:48,910
little stickers I'll take my enough it

1238
00:53:53,100 --> 00:53:51,700
says and then big sticker it says my

1239
00:53:55,050 --> 00:53:53,110
first blood donation which isn't

1240
00:53:57,180 --> 00:53:55,060
strictly true because I used to give but

1241
00:54:00,150 --> 00:53:57,190
many many years ago right but there was

1242
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:00,160
a good day and a good example I think

1243
00:54:04,560 --> 00:54:02,770
Alethea yeah it definitely encouraged

1244
00:54:06,510 --> 00:54:04,570
the rest of the skeptical community to

1245
00:54:08,010 --> 00:54:06,520
get out there when they have time make

1246
00:54:10,860 --> 00:54:08,020
an appointment at their local

1247
00:54:13,080 --> 00:54:10,870
and donate under the Australian skeptics

1248
00:54:15,270 --> 00:54:13,090
group but you should tell the listeners

1249
00:54:18,750 --> 00:54:15,280
about how it felt to go through the

1250
00:54:20,460 --> 00:54:18,760
whole process Richard did I hurt oh I

1251
00:54:24,180 --> 00:54:20,470
sent you a message about that didn't I

1252
00:54:27,150 --> 00:54:24,190
from the chair well they they give you a

1253
00:54:31,250 --> 00:54:27,160
little finger prick in the interview the

1254
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:31,260
test to test the hemoglobin yeah and

1255
00:54:38,010 --> 00:54:34,930
your hemoglobin has to be over 120

1256
00:54:39,540 --> 00:54:38,020
if it's under 115 it's too low you don't

1257
00:54:43,650 --> 00:54:39,550
have enough red blood cells to donate so

1258
00:54:46,110 --> 00:54:43,660
it has to be 120 mine was really good so

1259
00:54:47,850 --> 00:54:46,120
was mine I'll have you know and that was

1260
00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:47,860
fine and they take that and they take

1261
00:54:50,070 --> 00:54:48,490
your blood pressure

1262
00:54:52,830 --> 00:54:50,080
they take yeah and mine was a little

1263
00:54:55,170 --> 00:54:52,840
high I don't know why but there you go

1264
00:54:58,440 --> 00:54:55,180
I mean you had a migraine last night so

1265
00:55:00,450 --> 00:54:58,450
that might could account for it and then

1266
00:55:02,340 --> 00:55:00,460
you walk through to a very comfortable

1267
00:55:05,910 --> 00:55:02,350
chair one you could easily fall asleep

1268
00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:05,920
on the reclining chair padded and then

1269
00:55:10,950 --> 00:55:08,650
yeah the needle going in hurts a tiny

1270
00:55:15,090 --> 00:55:10,960
little bit for about two seconds and

1271
00:55:16,830 --> 00:55:15,100
Jessica didn't hurt for you not all

1272
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:16,840
right maybe I'm different high pain

1273
00:55:21,720 --> 00:55:19,450
threshold I don't know well I mean it's

1274
00:55:23,310 --> 00:55:21,730
not as as if it's a pain I'd run away

1275
00:55:23,930 --> 00:55:23,320
from it it's just like out and then it

1276
00:55:29,310 --> 00:55:23,940
was over

1277
00:55:32,010 --> 00:55:29,320
okay I felt it I wouldn't say it was

1278
00:55:34,260 --> 00:55:32,020
pain yeah okay but when I get my

1279
00:55:36,300 --> 00:55:34,270
vaccinations that's that's completely

1280
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:36,310
painless that's just like I think that

1281
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:38,650
depends on the skill of the person

1282
00:55:43,290 --> 00:55:42,490
administering the injection nurses tend

1283
00:55:46,500 --> 00:55:43,300
to be really good because they have

1284
00:55:48,630 --> 00:55:46,510
heaps of practice doctors maybe not so

1285
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:48,640
good I don't know maybe I'm slandering

1286
00:55:53,370 --> 00:55:51,010
them I don't know I don't know I just

1287
00:55:54,960 --> 00:55:53,380
say I mean knows it wasn't bad at all

1288
00:55:57,630 --> 00:55:54,970
and then you sit there for about 10

1289
00:55:59,640 --> 00:55:57,640
minutes and the blood drains out of your

1290
00:56:01,830 --> 00:55:59,650
body you turn white and you know and in

1291
00:56:02,670 --> 00:56:01,840
here and then when it's all over they

1292
00:56:04,590 --> 00:56:02,680
bandage you up

1293
00:56:06,860 --> 00:56:04,600
you rest for a minute or two and out to

1294
00:56:09,980 --> 00:56:06,870
the kitchen to the cafeteria where you

1295
00:56:11,930 --> 00:56:09,990
dive in stuff your face yeah

1296
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:11,940
but we had milkshakes chocolates cookies

1297
00:56:15,500 --> 00:56:13,890
you brought some cookies Alethea I had

1298
00:56:17,270 --> 00:56:15,510
some peanut butter toast so I did really

1299
00:56:19,400 --> 00:56:17,280
well oh I can really recommend little

1300
00:56:21,980 --> 00:56:19,410
atheist cookies and herb farmers and

1301
00:56:24,470 --> 00:56:21,990
biscuits they're just awesome and the

1302
00:56:27,020 --> 00:56:24,480
other thing is they recommend that some

1303
00:56:29,420 --> 00:56:27,030
before you donate you have savory food

1304
00:56:33,470 --> 00:56:29,430
and the reason for this is they want you

1305
00:56:35,720 --> 00:56:33,480
to eat a reasonable amount of salt

1306
00:56:37,550 --> 00:56:35,730
because that makes you thirsty so

1307
00:56:40,370 --> 00:56:37,560
therefore you drink water and therefore

1308
00:56:41,840 --> 00:56:40,380
you rehydrate yeah that makes sense I

1309
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:41,850
was drinking all morning I was glad

1310
00:56:45,770 --> 00:56:43,050
there was a bathroom that I think I said

1311
00:56:47,570 --> 00:56:45,780
that before anyway a good a good lesson

1312
00:56:49,850 --> 00:56:47,580
I think for skeptics every early yeah

1313
00:56:51,470 --> 00:56:49,860
and thank you for helping put it putting

1314
00:56:54,770 --> 00:56:51,480
that together well thank you for

1315
00:56:57,290 --> 00:56:54,780
donating Richard and Jessica yeah and

1316
00:56:59,600 --> 00:56:57,300
thanks to ilithyia for the idea it was

1317
00:57:04,550 --> 00:56:59,610
Olivia's inspiration and she organized

1318
00:57:06,800 --> 00:57:04,560
it if you're interested in donating some

1319
00:57:09,920 --> 00:57:06,810
blood in Australia visit donate blood

1320
00:57:13,220 --> 00:57:09,930
comm today you and fill out the forms

1321
00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:13,230
make an appointment and you can donate

1322
00:57:16,700 --> 00:57:16,050
under the name of Australian skeptics if

1323
00:57:30,430 --> 00:57:16,710
you want

1324
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:32,690
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1325
00:57:36,799 --> 00:57:34,410
zone now if you're in Australia well

1326
00:57:39,589 --> 00:57:36,809
around the world really and you want to

1327
00:57:41,599 --> 00:57:39,599
keep up with information news and events

1328
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:41,609
with Australian skeptics head to

1329
00:57:46,910 --> 00:57:44,490
skeptics calm day you and sign up for

1330
00:57:49,579 --> 00:57:46,920
our free newsletter it's sort of the

1331
00:57:51,280 --> 00:57:49,589
bite-sized bits of sceptical information

1332
00:57:53,839 --> 00:57:51,290
you can have between

1333
00:57:55,609 --> 00:57:53,849
issues of the skeptic of the skeptic

1334
00:57:58,280 --> 00:57:55,619
magazine from Australian skeptics which

1335
00:58:00,980 --> 00:57:58,290
comes out four times a year you can get

1336
00:58:05,240 --> 00:58:00,990
the physical copy read it on the train

1337
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:05,250
or anywhere or you can sign up and get

1338
00:58:09,910 --> 00:58:07,770
the electronic copy which is the PDF is

1339
00:58:12,950 --> 00:58:09,920
the same thing or both if you want

1340
00:58:14,420 --> 00:58:12,960
skeptics calm today you thank you to

1341
00:58:18,829 --> 00:58:14,430
those people who support the skeptic

1342
00:58:23,030 --> 00:58:18,839
zone financially with paypal of patreon

1343
00:58:25,520 --> 00:58:23,040
and as I said last week oh and I got

1344
00:58:29,569 --> 00:58:25,530
into some trouble because last week I

1345
00:58:32,809 --> 00:58:29,579
said the words hey do to do to do Siri

1346
00:58:37,220 --> 00:58:32,819
and people were saying that their Siri

1347
00:58:38,930 --> 00:58:37,230
devices were activated but I asked Siri

1348
00:58:42,289 --> 00:58:38,940
last week what the Australian dollar was

1349
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:42,299
worth and let me ask I'll just ask Siri

1350
00:58:48,339 --> 00:58:44,010
again but I'll just edit out the bit of

1351
00:58:51,230 --> 00:58:48,349
me asking Siri so you'll understand

1352
00:58:58,339 --> 00:58:51,240
what's 10 u.s. dollars in Australian

1353
00:59:00,020 --> 00:58:58,349
dollars 10 u.s. dollars is $13.98 okay a

1354
00:59:03,109 --> 00:59:00,030
slight variation there from last week

1355
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:03,119
but still your American dollar goes

1356
00:59:07,490 --> 00:59:05,010
further here in Australia with the

1357
00:59:09,650 --> 00:59:07,500
exchange rate so if you've ever

1358
00:59:10,940 --> 00:59:09,660
considered contributing or donating to

1359
00:59:14,660 --> 00:59:10,950
the skeptic zone or signing on to

1360
00:59:16,309 --> 00:59:14,670
patreon your dollar goes further and if

1361
00:59:18,829 --> 00:59:16,319
I only had a small percentage of

1362
00:59:22,130 --> 00:59:18,839
listeners only chip-in say five dollars

1363
00:59:24,170 --> 00:59:22,140
a month with patreon it would certainly

1364
00:59:28,940 --> 00:59:24,180
go a long way in helping me keep the

1365
00:59:29,839 --> 00:59:28,950
skeptic zone going in your ears that's

1366
00:59:32,710 --> 00:59:29,849
not an insult

1367
00:59:35,870 --> 00:59:32,720
in your ears you know what I mean for

1368
00:59:39,170 --> 00:59:35,880
Sydney listeners links in the show notes

1369
00:59:41,810 --> 00:59:39,180
for you to RSVP for the free trivia

1370
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:41,820
night coming up on the 12th of

1371
00:59:45,650 --> 00:59:43,410
here in Sydney just before the

1372
00:59:48,140 --> 00:59:45,660
convention and you can meet people like

1373
00:59:51,829 --> 00:59:48,150
dr. Alice haloth where we interviewed on

1374
00:59:54,349 --> 00:59:51,839
this episode but for this week this is

1375
01:00:00,740 --> 00:59:54,359
Richard Saunders signing off from Sydney

1376
01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:00,750
Australia you've been listening to the

1377
01:00:10,130 --> 01:00:03,450
skeptic zone podcast please visit our

1378
01:00:12,920 --> 01:00:10,140
website at wwlp.com tax and to access

1379
01:00:16,550 --> 01:00:12,930
the bat catalog of episodes going back

1380
01:00:20,180 --> 01:00:16,560
to 2008 you can follow the skeptic zone

1381
01:00:22,579 --> 01:00:20,190
podcast on twitter at skeptic zone visit

1382
01:00:23,470 --> 01:00:22,589
our facebook page or leave a review on

1383
01:00:26,570 --> 01:00:23,480
itunes

1384
01:00:29,540 --> 01:00:26,580
you can also support the skeptic zone by

1385
01:00:32,260 --> 01:00:29,550
a patreon or PayPal the skeptic zone

1386
01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:32,270
podcast is an independent production

1387
01:00:36,770 --> 01:00:34,650
reviews and opinions expressed on the

1388
01:00:39,109 --> 01:00:36,780
skeptic zone are not necessarily those

1389
01:00:40,940 --> 01:00:39,119
of Australian skeptics or any other

1390
01:00:55,990 --> 01:00:40,950
skeptical organization

1391
01:00:56,000 --> 01:01:00,220
[Music]

1392
01:01:05,690 --> 01:01:02,630
hello again to all the people who listen

1393
01:01:08,210 --> 01:01:05,700
to the show after the music I know what

1394
01:01:12,370 --> 01:01:08,220
you want yes you're waiting to play the

1395
01:01:13,940 --> 01:01:12,380
dice game the test your psychic powers

1396
01:01:17,150 --> 01:01:13,950
yeah okay

1397
01:01:18,320 --> 01:01:17,160
I've got this week a three sided die and

1398
01:01:20,600 --> 01:01:18,330
a ten sided die

1399
01:01:23,300 --> 01:01:20,610
um well three sided I'll roll it three

1400
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:23,310
times let's see here we go

1401
01:01:32,410 --> 01:01:27,330
so use your psychic powers predict it's

1402
01:01:35,870 --> 01:01:32,420
gonna be one two or three one

1403
01:01:43,370 --> 01:01:35,880
how'd you go let's do it again - good

1404
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:43,380
shake and predict away and one close

1405
01:01:50,720 --> 01:01:44,730
it's a one in three chance isn't it

1406
01:01:52,370 --> 01:01:50,730
last one predict the future ah you're

1407
01:01:53,150 --> 01:01:52,380
not gonna believe this well it's two

1408
01:01:56,300 --> 01:01:53,160
this time

1409
01:01:58,490 --> 01:01:56,310
one one two now let's try it with the

1410
01:02:00,590 --> 01:01:58,500
ten sided die are you ready it's going

1411
01:02:04,660 --> 01:02:00,600
to be one two three four five six seven

1412
01:02:07,010 --> 01:02:04,670
eight nine or ten predict the future

1413
01:02:07,390 --> 01:02:07,020
fell off the table try again predict the

1414
01:02:12,440 --> 01:02:07,400
future

1415
01:02:15,260 --> 01:02:12,450
no went under the computer five five but

1416
01:02:25,930 --> 01:02:15,270
I'll do it three times here we go and